By: Griffon39
- 9th February 2013 at 12:16Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
^For it to magically become light fighter.
That's exactely what I feared. Well, I hope they know what they are doing (and I'm sure they probbably do) and dont let them selves be dragged into the glamorous looking but Ruble/USD/EUR-eating "Light Fighter"-trap.
By: mack8
- 9th February 2013 at 12:29Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
^Indeed.
Three more Su-35S' coming up...
Great news. Borts red 09 , red 11 ( thanks djox) and red 12 :D
All credit goes to PhotoMius (sp?)
New
Posts: 2,171
By: Berkut
- 9th February 2013 at 12:54Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
So last one is 11? They sure love to f*ck with us b/n wise. :) No sign of 10 or 5...
New
Posts: 3,381
By: Rii
- 9th February 2013 at 14:42Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
That's exactely what I feared. Well, I hope they know what they are doing (and I'm sure they probbably do) and dont let them selves be dragged into the glamorous looking but Ruble/USD/EUR-eating "Light Fighter"-trap.
Why is this a trap? Modern combat aircraft are too complex and expensive for many nations to operate, and even nations that can afford top-tier gear would appreciate inexpensive aircraft suited to less demanding operations, e.g. France in its African Adventures.
By: Griffon39
- 9th February 2013 at 15:02Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Why is this a trap? Modern combat aircraft are too complex and expensive for many nations to operate, and even nations that can afford top-tier gear would appreciate inexpensive aircraft suited to less demanding operations, e.g. France in its African Adventures.
Oh, really? And pray tell how much sucess have all the various souped up single-seat versions-of-small-two-seat-trainers had on the international market over the years? Hell, not even JF-17 (which arguably is the most capable of all current "light fighters") has managed to score any sales outside PRC/Pakistan.
What country -that faces a credible military threath and is serious about its armed forces- has recently dropped the traditional fighter jet concept in favour of these "super trainers"? How is T-50 doing? Tejas? Hawk 200?
And the thing is, if you start to add to all these facy bells and whisles like AESA-radars, HMDs and what not -just to market it as a "fighter" -it wont take long until your little pet project isnt very cheap anymore. And then there will be even less logical reasons for a sane customer to buy it.
Not even the African countries seem to fall for it. Uganda is going for Flankers. 10 times the bang for twice the price..
And about France and Mali.. Why would the French want any slow and vounerable AESA-equipped trainers to buzz around in? If they want anything less expencive than a Rafalle/K2K for lower risk missions they all ready have the F1. Not to mention UAVs and crussies.
IMHO, trainers are trainers. Some secondary light strike capacity if need be is a great bonus. But leave it at that. Its chief purpose is to train new pilots so that they eventually can move on to the reall, destignated killing machines.
By: Anonymous
- 10th February 2013 at 13:16Permalink- Edited 22nd October 2019 at 22:31
SUCH a pretty machine! Even the light blue underside has grown on me a bit, although I still maintain they should either go back to the three-tone blue top side or paint the entire aircraft in dark grey (ideally matt, rather than the relatively glossy finish it has currently).
New
By: Anonymous
- 10th February 2013 at 21:43Permalink- Edited 22nd October 2019 at 22:31
By: blackwood
- 13th February 2013 at 10:11Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Is there something wrong with the pak-fa blogg. I cant get past page 4, which ended 9 th feb, yet people have been adding to it since then. Both home computer and mobile show same.
New
Posts: 3,381
By: Rii
- 13th February 2013 at 11:10Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
^ Yeah there's some problem with that thread for sure.
By: Flanker_man
- 13th February 2013 at 11:23Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Is there something wrong with the pak-fa blogg. I cant get past page 4, which ended 9 th feb, yet people have been adding to it since then. Both home computer and mobile show same.
If you click on the 'Post Reply' button you can see all the latest posts in reverse order below the reply window.
Its a 'dirty' solution to the temporary(?) problem.
Posts: 2,171
By: Berkut - 9th February 2013 at 12:06 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
^Indeed.
Three more Su-35S' coming up...
Posts: 920
By: Griffon39 - 9th February 2013 at 12:16 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
That's exactely what I feared. Well, I hope they know what they are doing (and I'm sure they probbably do) and dont let them selves be dragged into the glamorous looking but Ruble/USD/EUR-eating "Light Fighter"-trap.
Posts: 2,114
By: mack8 - 9th February 2013 at 12:29 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Great news. Borts red 09 , red 11 ( thanks djox) and red 12 :D
All credit goes to PhotoMius (sp?)
Posts: 2,171
By: Berkut - 9th February 2013 at 12:54 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
So last one is 11? They sure love to f*ck with us b/n wise. :) No sign of 10 or 5...
Posts: 3,381
By: Rii - 9th February 2013 at 14:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Why is this a trap? Modern combat aircraft are too complex and expensive for many nations to operate, and even nations that can afford top-tier gear would appreciate inexpensive aircraft suited to less demanding operations, e.g. France in its African Adventures.
Posts: 920
By: Griffon39 - 9th February 2013 at 15:02 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Oh, really? And pray tell how much sucess have all the various souped up single-seat versions-of-small-two-seat-trainers had on the international market over the years? Hell, not even JF-17 (which arguably is the most capable of all current "light fighters") has managed to score any sales outside PRC/Pakistan.
What country -that faces a credible military threath and is serious about its armed forces- has recently dropped the traditional fighter jet concept in favour of these "super trainers"? How is T-50 doing? Tejas? Hawk 200?
And the thing is, if you start to add to all these facy bells and whisles like AESA-radars, HMDs and what not -just to market it as a "fighter" -it wont take long until your little pet project isnt very cheap anymore. And then there will be even less logical reasons for a sane customer to buy it.
Not even the African countries seem to fall for it. Uganda is going for Flankers. 10 times the bang for twice the price..
And about France and Mali.. Why would the French want any slow and vounerable AESA-equipped trainers to buzz around in? If they want anything less expencive than a Rafalle/K2K for lower risk missions they all ready have the F1. Not to mention UAVs and crussies.
IMHO, trainers are trainers. Some secondary light strike capacity if need be is a great bonus. But leave it at that. Its chief purpose is to train new pilots so that they eventually can move on to the reall, destignated killing machines.
Posts: 2,114
By: mack8 - 9th February 2013 at 15:03 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Apparently that twin-engine UAV is called Altius-M:
http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-719.html
Posts: 8,850
By: MSphere - 9th February 2013 at 16:41 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
05 featured on page 22
http://en.take-off.ru/pdf_to/to25.pdf
Posts: 6,441
By: haavarla - 10th February 2013 at 09:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Those pics link does not work.. pls repost them :)
Posts: 1,286
By: Jō Asakura - 10th February 2013 at 13:08 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
haavarla,
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/455595.html
http://russianplanes.net/id97061
http://russianplanes.net/id97063
http://russianplanes.net/id97088
By: Anonymous - 10th February 2013 at 13:16 Permalink - Edited 22nd October 2019 at 22:31
SUCH a pretty machine! Even the light blue underside has grown on me a bit, although I still maintain they should either go back to the three-tone blue top side or paint the entire aircraft in dark grey (ideally matt, rather than the relatively glossy finish it has currently).
By: Anonymous - 10th February 2013 at 21:43 Permalink - Edited 22nd October 2019 at 22:31
Very evocative picture:
http://russianplanes.net/id97106
Posts: 131
By: owais.usmani - 11th February 2013 at 19:40 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
:diablo:
Posts: 2,114
By: mack8 - 11th February 2013 at 23:46 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Su-35S (09,11,12) gallery:
http://ru-aviation.livejournal.com/2517539.html
Su-34 galleries:
http://www.kommersant.ru/gallery/pic/826348
http://dmitrydreamer.livejournal.com/41295.html
Posts: 2,171
By: Berkut - 12th February 2013 at 00:01 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
That would be 06, and that picture has been available on KnAAPO site for some time.
Thanks for the links mack.
Posts: 1,642
By: Twinblade - 12th February 2013 at 16:26 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Russian Knights at Aero India 2013
Posts: 307
By: blackwood - 13th February 2013 at 10:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Is there something wrong with the pak-fa blogg. I cant get past page 4, which ended 9 th feb, yet people have been adding to it since then. Both home computer and mobile show same.
Posts: 3,381
By: Rii - 13th February 2013 at 11:10 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
^ Yeah there's some problem with that thread for sure.
Not necessarily a great Su-35 shot, just a great shot!
Posts: 3,652
By: Flanker_man - 13th February 2013 at 11:23 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If you click on the 'Post Reply' button you can see all the latest posts in reverse order below the reply window.
Its a 'dirty' solution to the temporary(?) problem.
Ken
Posts: 307
By: blackwood - 13th February 2013 at 13:12 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thanks to Flanker Guy and Rii, thread looks like just got fixed.:D