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By: - 9th September 2015 at 12:04 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The complete aircraft is an early Dornier Do17 - possibly Do17P or M, judging by the inline engines. Flying Pencil will tell us more of he spots it!
Beyond that I'm afraid I can't help.
Adrian
By: - 9th September 2015 at 13:39 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It is probably the former Croat Do17E - Axis Sally, W.Nr.2095, which was sent to America after the war as FE-2000 and scrapped in 1946.
By: - 9th September 2015 at 13:55 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
No 4 is a Henschel ground attack aircraft - Hs129, and I think the next three photos show the rest of it's fuselage.
Adrian
By: - 9th September 2015 at 14:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The final three are an Arado 96 I think. North Africa?
John
By: - 9th September 2015 at 16:40 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
325th FG was stationed in Tunesia and Algeria Feb1943-Dec1943, then moved to Italy for the remainder of the war. I'd choose either of these three countries as my best guess. I'd say the clue would be in the Croatian Do17. Find out where that used to hang out, and you may find a match.
By: - 9th September 2015 at 16:45 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Could be Freeman Field in the USA. They are currently digging up quite a bit of Axis and British wreckage there.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 05:56 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The complete aircraft is an early Dornier Do17 - possibly Do17P or M, judging by the inline engines. Flying Pencil will tell us more of he spots it!Beyond that I'm afraid I can't help.
Adrian
:)
It is probably the former Croat Do17E - Axis Sally, W.Nr.2095, which was sent to America after the war as FE-2000 and scrapped in 1946.
Strong possibility, but this image before said ID appeared.
No 4 is a Henschel ground attack aircraft - Hs129, and I think the next three photos show the rest of it's fuselage.Adrian
I agree, the last 4 are same.
The final three are an Arado 96 I think. North Africa?John
No, also Hs-129, last 4 same.
Others seem to be Ju-52's
325th FG was stationed in Tunesia and Algeria Feb1943-Dec1943, then moved to Italy for the remainder of the war. I'd choose either of these three countries as my best guess. I'd say the clue would be in the Croatian Do17. Find out where that used to hang out, and you may find a match.
Could be Freeman Field in the USA. They are currently digging up quite a bit of Axis and British wreckage there.
Interesting possibilities.
Although Sally would have to be shipped by boat, would not have range to fly.
I recently saw new image of Sally on web, cant find it now (saved image)
Here is artist rendering, apparently wrong coloUr.
MP, can I get permission to use that image for future project?
By: - 10th September 2015 at 06:16 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Bingo!
stated:
Source Disposition
War Prizes
pg 222 in storage in incomplete condition at Freeman Field on 17 May 1946
War Prizes
pg 222 'salvaged' (US terminology for scrapped) on 25 September 1946
Unsalvageable
01/17/1947 At Wright Field
DO 172, T2-2000
Instruments not complete.
Hydraulic system not installed.
Landing gear not installed.
engines not installed.
So the image seems to be in Italy, while it was shipped to USA, but never fully reassembled.
AND possible she is Do-17F, no bomb sight dome.
Question:
Was is captured in Croatia??
UPDATE: Film below one can see the housing for bomb sight in it, so it was removed when above image taken, and name applied.
Where can I access US archives for FE-2000?
By: - 10th September 2015 at 12:23 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Interesting, you can see form the B+W pic why Sally might be thought of as grey or natural metal (I modelled her that way about 20 years ago)
By: - 10th September 2015 at 13:28 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Could be Freeman Field in the USA. They are currently digging up quite a bit of Axis and British wreckage there.
I had been thinking about that, but the amount of Ju52's in the pictures is I think too great for Freeman... Were there that many brought over?
By: - 10th September 2015 at 13:54 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I'm convinced the scrapyard is El Aouiana (near Tunis, Tunesia) in mid to late 1943. More pics of the aircraft in this thread: http://histomil.com/viewtopic.php?f=345&t=691&hilit=1934&start=250 (including the Hs129 marked "X" and Ju52 T2B), they appear to be images from the Getty archive. 325th FG operated in Tunesia Jun-Dec1943.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 14:28 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
And the Do17 may well have been shot in Italy, where 325th went after North Africa. Most defecting Croatian aircraft were flown to Italy due to range.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 14:34 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I'm convinced the scrapyard is El Aouiana (near Tunis, Tunesia) in mid to late 1943. More pics of the aircraft in this thread: http://histomil.com/viewtopic.php?f=345&t=691&hilit=1934&start=250 (including the Hs129 marked "X" and Ju52 T2B), they appear to be images from the Getty archive. 325th FG operated in Tunesia Jun-Dec1943.
Looks like you found it!
I suspect Sally was ex-Spanish.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 15:36 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
:)Strong possibility, but this image before said ID appeared.
I agree, the last 4 are same.
No, also Hs-129, last 4 same.
Others seem to be Ju-52'sInteresting possibilities.
Although Sally would have to be shipped by boat, would not have range to fly.I recently saw new image of Sally on web, cant find it now (saved image)
Here is artist rendering, apparently wrong coloUr.MP, can I get permission to use that image for future project?
Yes of-course. When I get a chance I will upload the brief video clip of it that shows both sides as it was filmed by the pilot while taxiing his P-47 past it :)
By: - 10th September 2015 at 15:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
And the Do17 may well have been shot in Italy, where 325th went after North Africa. Most defecting Croatian aircraft were flown to Italy due to range.
That is possible!
The film may be complication of shorts over months. Some in Tunis, and some time later in Italy.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 15:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Yes, this is the same place. Excellent link. Many thanks. He did serve with them during the Tunis period so this ties in perfectly. The footage that follows the graveyard clip is a huge military procession through streets with some camel riders, a huge French military March past, US March past (with two black painted Sherman tanks), it almost looks like a victory parade? It may well be. The footage also shows some 325th pilots (not in flight uniform) looking over a German graveyard (black crosses on headstones) but no names can be seen. It's a really fascinating hour of footage.
As I said above, when I get the chance I'll upload some clips of footage. Cheers, MP
By: - 10th September 2015 at 17:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Here's the short clip of video :)
By: - 10th September 2015 at 19:23 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Amazing!
Besides that forest of Ju-52 tails and Hs-129 is at least 2x Ju-88 tails,.. and more I can't ID.
By: - 10th September 2015 at 19:45 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Excellent video. Please note in your comment the aircraft is not a Do217, but a Do17. A different beast indeed ;-)
The view of the Do17 is indeed shot from a P-47, meaning it is post-September 1943 when 325th FG started to convert from P-40 to P-47. Could be Tunesia (Sep1943-Dec1943) or Italy (>Dec1943). The tail markings of the B-24 next to the Do17 show it to be from the 12th AF, 98th BW, which was baed in Tunesia Sep1943-Nov1943 and then went to Italy. So could still be either country.
The victory march is in Tunis, along the Avenue Gambetta, with troops from the Free French, Britain and US. Excellent footage of the march here: http://www.britishpathe.com/video/victory-march-in-tunis
By: - 12th September 2015 at 00:28 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I'm reminded that the USAAF also had a Bf109 in a very similar colour scheme
Posts: 211
By: Mysticpuma - 9th September 2015 at 11:35 - Edited 2nd October 2019 at 11:40
I have just been sent some footage from a friend in the USA who's father served with the 325th Fighter group. There is about an hour of footage from his time in service including footage taken while out and about. In the footage are some really (I think) interesting images that I wonder if someone here may be able to work out where they were taken? I believe it is sometime between 1943 and 1944
All I can say is that the following images are taken from approx. 15-seconds of footage that appear to show a Luftwaffe aircraft scrapyard. Markings are visible so hopefully that may give a clue as to where they were stationed?
As a bonus image, he also filmed (very briefly) a captured repainted German aircraft (think it's a Ju-88?), can't give a date for the footage though.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]240364[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]240365[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]240366[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]240367[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]240368[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]240369[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]240370[/ATTACH]
The first image is made from two frames I stitched together to show the complete aircraft.
Cheers, MP