Battle of Britain Hurricane recovery

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Member for

9 years 5 months

Posts: 172

Is this P3966? I thought this had previously been salvaged in the 80's?

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/hurricane-war-plane-unearthed-near-thames-estuary-11679592

Original post

Member for

24 years 2 months

Posts: 2,435

Gotta....get.....that data plate!

Member for

15 years 3 months

Posts: 923

hi morning all,
great, can't have too many Hurries...
regards,
jack...

Member for

20 years

Posts: 1,496

I remember trekking across those marshes with Elliot looking for a Hurricane a few years ago, the same one??

Member for

19 years 5 months

Posts: 9,821

The Sky News report said "...if enough is found, it can be rebuilt..."
Anyone care to say how much that is?

FlyPast recently published a photo of some Spitfire wreckage found in Norway, which is being rebuilt to fly. Most of the aircraft was missing and the parts they had looked only good enough for patterns (but given the Spitfire restoration industry, I suspect patterns are not needed).
So we have Spitfire, Hurricane and Mustang airframes which seem to be 99% new, yet the CAA apparently looks the other way and allows the story to be perpetrated that these are somehow "restored" and not new build airframes.

The CAA seems pretty strict about a lot of things (like ex-military (Lightning, Shack, etc.) types not being allowed to fly in the UK, yet they allow this.

Why?

Member for

24 years 2 months

Posts: 2,435

I’ve wondered the same thing. UK dataplate reconstructions are permitted, but concours standard aircraft from abroad are not. No doubt there are CAA rules and regs which can be quoted to allow this, but where’s the balance?

Member for

14 years 10 months

Posts: 249

All comes back to the data plate argument. There are those who idolise any new data plate rebuild when it takes to the air and there are those who remain sceptical. I have no idea why the CAA has not seen through it yet. All will be well unless - God forbid - there is a serious accident when, in all liklihood, the full weight of an embarrassed CAA will fall upon those involved and that will be the end of it.

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24 years 2 months

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Yes Denis - the same one. That was a good day!

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24 years 2 months

Posts: 8,464

The point about data plate reconstructions carried out in this country is that they are done under the auspices and control of the CAA and companies approved by them. There is a clear paperwork trail that allows comparison with an original standard. For aircraft that are brought in, complete, from abroad, that is often missing.

In this case, I would note that it is quite possible, depending on how much material has been brought to the surface, that a fuselage could be built that has easily as many original pieces as many other Hurricanes flying today, and possibly more. However, I genuinely don't see that we will see many more complete Hurricane restorations now.

Bruce

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14 years 5 months

Posts: 3,447

To amplify Bruce's point, the answer as to why the CAA seem 'blind' to dataplate builds is because that is not what they are there for.

The CAA are not there to provide a stamp of authenticity to anything. That would be an utterly pointless role for an expensive organisation.

The CAA are there to ensure safety in all things flying. Now, they have a register, and that register includes what is written on the aircraft in terms of identity and original manufacturer. That is what they will call that aircraft as they undergo the process of inspection and certification. It avoids any confusion in the records whatsoever - they register it as whatever is on their chosen 'dataplate' for the type. This needs to be unique, and if they use an original dataplate, wherever it's from, it is.

Yes, it does introduce the absurdity of 99.9% 'new' aircraft flying being called 'original' by those that do not understand that you can't unbend any piece of rusty metal and stick it into the structure of a new aeroplane then expect to get it certified airworthy. But it's not some kind of ignorance, or 'blindness', on the part of the CAA that leads to this.

Hurricanes are unusual - their construction method means that in actual fact in some cases you can do just that, even in primary structure. It's very different with a monocoque,

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20 years

Posts: 1,496

Yes Denis - the same one. That was a good day!

Were you involved in this recovery Elliot? if so well done :)

Member for

24 years 2 months

Posts: 2,598

Can anyone tell me where the Data Plate would have been fixed ?? Cockpit ??

Hawker Aircraft Ltd
Serial No 41H131658
Drawing No: D57580 D72075

P3966

Date 10 8 1940

Stamped HA217

Thanks

Paul

Member for

17 years 10 months

Posts: 3,778

in the cockpit Paul I think on the port side forward of the throttles and before the firewall.
I think there are two data plates, that is the main one and a smaller aluminium one, but that is the brass Makers Plate, Gloster built Hurricanes IIRC had the number also stamped into the end of the port side engine mount

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20 years

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Wow, some cracking finds there! Well done! TT

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24 years 2 months

Posts: 2,598

Thanks Trolly Aux

date should be 10 6 1940

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24 years 2 months

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Thanks for the link to the Flickr stream TrolleyAux, that spade grip is in amazing condition all things considered. Great to see Mr. Hemingway himself looking so good for his 99 years too!

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24 years 2 months

Posts: 3,415

If they had any idea of the work involved in looking after XS456, idiots would stop asking Craig Wise why he does not fly his T5.... and why she is a static! We would love to see a Lightning fly, but its impossible. Engines are thin on the ground for the taxiable ones.

This Hurricane, now that will be a sight.