Calais, migrants and everything related (Merged thread)

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This is just some thoughts I have had, and I expect its shot through with flaws but I just wanted to get them down. I do not have a daily paper so the news I get from today Radio4 and news @7 on 4. What I would do about the current situation at Calais, France. !/ organize coaches to collect the refugees/migrants. 2/provide accommodation using old MOD properties. 3/Give each person the facilities to have a private bath and have clean clothes. 4/Provide hot meals and a clean bed to sleep in. 5/Provide full medical attention. 6/take full names and their previous address. 7/Details of families. 8/details of what they are running away from. 8/ Ask for criminal histories 9/ Teach them English. 10 Give each one a National Insurance Number with the Prefix RI for Refugee/Immigrant 10/Intergrate them with our own unemployed and teach them all a trade and or further education incl Universaty. 11/ Get all them to sign an individual agreement that they must get a Job and stay for 5 years before being allowed to leave for a holiday or emigration. 12/ After 6-8 years they will be entitled to having the RI letters removed from their NI No. It would be wonderful if the other EU members sponsored similar programmes throughout their individual countries. This action of itself would nullify some of ISIS propaganda and the radicalisation that takes place painting the west as the epitome of evil. How desperate would you have to be to risk losing your life stowing away on a lorry? What would make you prepared to travel thousands of miles, risking drowning and sleeping rough in freezing weather. Do you think these stowaways have a lower value on their lives than you do? These people are not terrorists, or members of an army unit who are prepared to die for the unit or a cause. Would you risk all that for the benefits available here. I have no idea what they are in actual fact entitled to, and if they are that desperate then they need our help anyway. The driving force must be similar to escaping pow’s in WW2. The desire to get to England to continue the war was their driving force. These lorry hoppers must believe that their future is here, so, why are they not entitled to get here for a better life. They are so young, but much older and they would not survive the rigours of the journey. What they are running from must be 100’s of times worse to make them chance the journey. They are Human beings and because of that alone they deserve our help.
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13 years

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I only foresee one major problem with this 'solution'... ...today there are three to five thousand refugees / economic migrants at Calais; once word gets around there will be tens of thousands patiently waiting for the next (British) National Express coach to turn-up! Actually, I can think of a lot more problems than that, but that is the main one.
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The trouble is that our benefits are so very easily come by, thats the reason they want to come here. Upon getting here they are given a full medical workup, fed, watered, money thrown at them by the DSS. Thats why they tear up any means of themselves being I.Dd. so you never know where they come from, and we just believe everything they say. I would make EVERY HGV pass through a moving assembly line, in a building especialy built, that pumped tear gas into the building(ON a re circling system to cut costs down), thus causing any hiding person to give themselves up. obviously there would have to be a conveyor built system so that the HGV drivers would not have to stay in their vehicles, but the authorities who were inside the building could open the rear doors, wearing gas masks, and if found MT then seal the doors closed again. That way, there would be no need for all the expence of Policing, wire fencing,etc, as one solution would fit all, word would soon get round, and the problem would IMHO lessen to a greater betterment.I guess they heard the old addage that the streets of London are paved with Gold, well, they were until Gordon Brown sold it at an all time low.Pillock.!! Jim. Lincoln .7
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Dumb question. If the trailer is locked immediately after loading and left locked migrants will be unable to enter, won't they? As for the OP's proposal I can see a myriad of problems.

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I'd go for electric fences, minefields ! armed guards and Rottweilers. Pill boxes at entrance to tunnels.
Profile picture for user Lincoln 7

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Chas, No, because where the building would be sited, would be close to the tunnel, with no way of getting into or onto the trucks. I'ts only a rough idea, but would need further improvements to make it work by a better man than I. But it's not beyond being done. (BTW, are you O.K. not seen you here in a while.) Jim. Lincoln .7
Profile picture for user Lincoln 7

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C.D. Warren, your the Forum whiz kid, when it comes to figures, so are you able to tell s what each migrant costs the British Tax payer in handouts when they get here, and also the cost of Policing the other side of the Tunnel, to try and keep them out?. I see that Cameron/ Home Sec are paying £7 Mil to errect a new wire fence, why are WE paying for it?. Jim. Lincoln .7
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Dumb question. If the trailer is locked immediately after loading and left locked migrants will be unable to enter, won't they?
It works for ISO containers provided the padlock is resistant to some serious bolt cutters. Doesn't work for trailers, most have glass fibre roofs.
I see that Cameron/ Home Sec are paying £7 Mil to errect a new wire fence, why are WE paying for it?.
To protect our borders? Moggy
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O.K. Moggs, then build the bloody gas chambers THIS side of the tunnel, and any caught, no farting around or pussyfooting about, just send them back to France straight away. It's a shame we cant adopt the Aussies way of dealing with folks that try and get into their Country. Jim. Lincoln .7
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I'm not clear why somebody should be executed for trying to escape an awful situation in their own country, or to simply better themselves. I certainly wouldn't want to be associated with such a scheme. (But then, neither would you in reality Jim) :) Moggy

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...are you able to tell us what each migrant costs the British Tax payer in handouts when they get here...
No, and I doubt anybody in government knows either but in terms of what the road-haulage industry claims the disruption is costing them it would probably be 'cheaper' to let all the migrants in. Except that it wouldn't! It is not an easy question. One thing to bear in mind is that only the top 40% of all taxpayers actually contribute to the social balance of payments; everybody else, over the course of their life, takes out more in health, education, pension, benefits, policing (!), than they ever pay in tax. That is quite a sobering thought for most British taxpayers (well those that give it a thought anyway) never mind an economic migrant. So, even if a migrant gets a job immediately, claims minimum benefits (difficult if claiming housing benefit) he is hardly likely to get into the top 40% tax bracket during his lifetime so, in that case, he is going to be nothing but a drain on our economy. He may, of course, do a necessary job that none of our own unemployed are prepared to do: (NHS) cleaning or social care of the elderly but these are still generally low pay jobs. He is never going to benefit the economy in a 'hand car wash' and all that assumes that he isn't going to try to bring the rest of his family over the moment he is 'legal'; the calculation is much more complex if you include his wife, children and parents? Much of Britain's foreign aid budget, currently £14billion per year, is spent trying to solve the problems some of these migrants are supposedly fleeing from; so do we add that to the calculation?
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I'm not clear why somebody should be executed for trying to escape an awful situation in their own country, or to simply better themselves. I certainly wouldn't want to be associated with such a scheme. (But then, neither would you in reality Jim) :) Moggy
I am not advocating their execution by gassing them, it's just a way of showing if there are migrants stowed away in HGVs. If as you say, they are fleeing their own Country because they are in fear of their lives, then why isn't the WHOLE of that Country fleeing to get here also, You can't just cherry pick. Jim. Lincoln .7

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I wonder why it is, that the vast majority of those trying to get into this country, are men. Where are the women and children ? You also have to ask, what happens to the huge amounts of money pumped into the countries in foreign aid ?, where many of these people come from. Millions has been given to African countries over the decades, but you still see adds on TV begging for money to be spent on starving African children. Walk into virtually any church, and there will be a table dedicated to the work the church is still doing to alleviate pain and suffering in one African country or another. Where is it all going ?
Profile picture for user Moggy C

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.....he is hardly likely to get into the top 40% tax bracket during his lifetime so, in that case, he is going to be nothing but a drain on our economy. He may, of course, do a necessary job that none of our own unemployed are prepared to do: (NHS) cleaning or social care of the elderly
The last two I heard interviewed on the BBC wireless were a dentist and an electronics engineer. Just saying. Moggy
Profile picture for user charliehunt

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Chas, No, because where the building would be sited, would be close to the tunnel, with no way of getting into or onto the trucks. I'ts only a rough idea, but would need further improvements to make it work by a better man than I. But it's not beyond being done. (BTW, are you O.K. not seen you here in a while.) Jim. Lincoln .7
Not bad thanks, but busy with other stuff...but still take a look here now and then...and a bit more in Historic. But not sure what you mean by a "building".

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The last two I heard interviewed on the BBC wireless were a dentist and an electronics engineer.
Interesting. And these were people trying to stowaway on vehicles in Calais? It begs the question why they needed to stowaway at all; couldn't they, with those skills, just apply for a job in the UK? And surely there is some sort of regulation of those practicing dentistry in this country; as a illegal immigrant surely the dentist would fall foul of some element of this regulation? Or maybe his qualification is not recognised in the UK? It would be a pity if after all it took to become a dentist he ended-up driving a taxi? The other side of the coin is what about the country where there immigrants came from; have they such a surplus of dentists and electronics engineers that their own economy is not affected by these skilled people heading abroad for a better life?
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I agree with Jim,Stop every truck and spray CS Gas into it and open the ones you hear coughing from. If you stop every truck you will soon have a nice traffic jam across France and that might make the French take it more seriously and devote more resources to their problem!
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... BBC wireless...
On the Home Service, was it? Honestly. You still listening to prerecorded music on wax cylinders, or have you moved up to a wind-up gramophone yet?
...as a illegal immigrant surely the dentist would fall foul of some element of this regulation? Or maybe his qualification is not recognised in the UK? It would be a pity if after all it took to become a dentist he ended-up driving a taxi?
Ok then, I'll do the 'honours'... Tee hee. Maybe they feared he would turn out to be an American hunter, trying to avoid the publicity?
Profile picture for user j_jza80

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Once you pass through a perfectly safe country (Greece, Italy, France etc) you cease being a refugee and become an economic/social migrant. With the exception of Belgium, we already have the highest population density in the EU.
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^^^ What he said.
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I'm not clear why somebody should be executed for trying to escape an awful situation in their own country, or to simply better themselves. I certainly wouldn't want to be associated with such a scheme. (But then, neither would you in reality Jim) :) Moggy
I don't think anyone seriously advocates executions, but the way I look at it there's a world of difference between genuine refugees who we ought to help, and so-called economic migrants who seem to think "That's a rich country; I'll help myself to a bit of it, and XXXX whether they actually want me there or not"