Flt Sgt Copping's P-40 From The Egyptian Desert

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Profile picture for user paulmcmillan

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21 years 6 months

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IF and a BIG IF it is Copping's aircraft then he certainly has an interesting back story as he was borh 3rd Qtr 1917 with abirth registered in Rochford

Acting Pilot Officer under a Short Service Commission on 20 Jan 1936, he then went to No. 10 Flying Training School, Tern Hill in February 1936, but his SSC was terminated on cessation of duty 17th July 1936

In between time he had time to file this patent with an address in Southend On Sea

http://patent.ipexl.com/GB/GB443466.html

However, as we know he was a Flight Sgt - and his Service number #785025 was in a batch between 785000 to 786999 (highest known number 786379) issued in July 1940 to Local enlistments in Far East

Profile picture for user RAFRochford

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15 years 5 months

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Hi Paul;

That's interesting information you've unearthed there! I note though, that the patent lists his name as being Coppin. Presumably, that is a mistake?

I maybe wrong, but I think that 10 Warrior Square may have been demolished to make way for the municipal swimming pool. Must have a look next time I'm there.

Regards;
Steve

Profile picture for user ozjag

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14 years 3 months

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Has anyone else noticed that in the recently posted photos the rear port canopy perspex is intact whereas in the first 'hatch' photo it had been broken and the pieces fallen behind each other? Also it appears to me that the battery has been deliberately ripped open and the individual cells ripped out, doesn't bode well in my mind.

Paul

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10 years 11 months

Posts: 83

Absolutely brilliant thread, what a find, just truly hope that its not lost to history by a modern day scavenger hunt.

I'm based around 10 miles from Southend and have done a lot of research on local guys from my own town and have contacts throughout the local press that I am sure would love to run the story if it can be confirmed this is Coppings aircraft.

If I can help in anyway on this just let me know and be happy to do what I can

Kind regards

Steve

www.wickfordmemorial.com

If Copping, and in view of Paul McMillan's posting regarding his techincal/electrical expertise, this might (and I repeat 'might') have some bearing on the removed radio, batteries etc. Had he taken it out and tried to get it going and transmit a desperate message? Sobering thought.

Also, note the parachute by the nose. Had the pilot rigged up a shelter/recognition signal/water condensation collector?

Or, even, could his remains be in the sand right there?

Also online at Kew are what seem to be divorce files for his parents in 1928.

Profile picture for user Dobbins

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Has anyone else noticed that in the recently posted photos the rear port canopy perspex is intact whereas in the first 'hatch' photo it had been broken and the pieces fallen behind each other? Also it appears to me that the battery has been deliberately ripped open and the individual cells ripped out, doesn't bode well in my mind.

Paul

Ah yes, well spotted. They also smashed the right side cockpit canopy perspex and nicked the ring and bead sight. I fear for this unique aircraft.

Well, its a long way from anywhere....!

Not likely to see hordes of passing scavengers, I'd have thought - unlike the Calais Spitfire which was systematically robbed and vandalised.

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11 years 1 month

Posts: 27

Ah yes, well spotted. They also smashed the right side cockpit canopy perspex and nicked the ring and bead sight. I fear for this unique aircraft.

Looks like they used a machete to remove the ring and bead sight unfortunately.:mad:

Hope they're beginning to understand the value of it now.....but I doubt it.

Profile picture for user shepsair

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P40

Steve

As mentioned, I think the identity needs to be confirmed before everyone goes to try and find Copping's family and declare his aircraft has been found.

When the serial is confirmed then Innsworth/AHB want to be notified as it involves a missing pilot.

I would not like to be a family member who gets told his planes been found and then find out it is not correct.

IF it is Copping, you therefore might be in a good position to help but lets wait until the identity is confirmed. Should only be a couple more days.

Andy, also found the divorce in 1928 with another women involved. Who would be classed as the next of kin - mother or father. Mother died in 1967 in Rockford. Additionally, if on a repair, transfer flight would he have had his kit with him Sounds as though they were also in retreat. Lot of North African log books were lost especially when the pilot was killed/missing.

regards

Mark

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11 years 1 month

Posts: 27

Steve

As mentioned, I think the identity needs to be confirmed before everyone goes to try and find Copping's family and declare his aircraft has been found.

When the serial is confirmed then Innsworth/AHB want to be notified as it involves a missing pilot.

I would not like to be a family member who gets told his planes been found and then find out it is not correct.

IF it is Copping, you therefore might be in a good position to help but lets wait until the identity is confirmed. Should only be a couple more days.

Andy, also found the divorce in 1928 with another women involved. Who would be classed as the next of kin - mother or father. Mother died in 1967 in Rockford. Additionally, if on a repair, transfer flight would he have had his kit with him Sounds as though they were also in retreat. Lot of North African log books were lost especially when the pilot was killed/missing.

regards

Mark

Are you in touch with these guys Mark? Just wondered from your recent remarks about the stuff going on in the background and the 2 day comment above. Just an educated guess?

Cheers

Mark

Not sure how NOK worked in those days. I suspect it rested with his father, although both mother and father are shown under NOK details with CWGC as you will have noted.

He could have had siblings, of course, as well as step-siblings or half-siblings.

I agree re the family, but I'd be surprised if any surviving family have not been tracked by someone, somewhere, already...even although the evidence is, at best, circumstantial. If they found out, then at least they can only be told that an aircraft that may have been his has been found. At least no body has been found; at least, so far as we know.

(On another matter, Mark, would like to be in touch with you soon-ish!)

Profile picture for user paulmcmillan

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21 years 6 months

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BTW has anyone got

Fighters Over The Desert

by Christopher Shores and Hans Ring and could tell us what it says for 28th June 1942 and the surrounding days in relation to 260 Sqn thanks

Please Ignore 28th June 1942 260 Sqn not mentioned at all..

Member for

10 years 11 months

Posts: 83

Absolutely, I would never jump the gun and try and trace the family or got to the local media, to then later be told it isn't his plane.

I'm purely offering local help should it prove to be Coppings plane and hopefully get some media attention that may, just may, help in finding the lost pilot and finally giving him the dignity of a decent burial.

In many ways I hope it isn't his plane and that the story of this one isn't as sad and lonely.

Offer stands for help and I will be watching the story with interest

Cheers

Steve

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16 years 3 months

Posts: 788

The YouTube video now has a notation: "there is practically no possibility of the devastation of the plane because it is army complex - patrolled by the army."

Apologies if this has already been pointed out here, although I don't think it has.

Profile picture for user shepsair

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11 years 9 months

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P40

Steve

I knew you would understand that - general note to all really.

Andy

Could find no siblings nor remarriages. The mother did not remarry. could not find any wills either. Death certificates are the next though will do a deeper search tonight for siblings.

Sutts
:-)

regards

Mark

The problem is, of course, that the name is already out there on the net and thus it isn't beyond the realms of possibility that it will be seen by a family member long before anything gets to the newspapers.

Its happened before, and quite recently, too!

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15 years 9 months

Posts: 2,318

STORMBIRD262,

Did you take the time to read the whole of this thread plus the comments on the video before making your statement? It has already been posted in the last few pages on this thread.

From the You Tube videos

The Egyptian government have been informed by the military. The army took only ammunition of the airplane to not hit the wrong hands. At the moment the plane is in the same state as in the movie. there is practically no possibility of the devastation of this plane because it is army complex - patrolled by the army.
The plane was found incidentally - do not do the explorations..
in mid-April, I'll try to go to the place where the plane - it will put more videos.
Profile picture for user Dobbins

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9 years 5 months

Posts: 442

Yes but they obviously didn't just take the ammo did they?

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14 years 9 months

Posts: 8,934

Might be wrong but has anyone noticed anything glaringly obvious on this?

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-6jlAf18ngSg/T5Zs-1nB16I/AAAAAAAAAM4/mzwru9lHb6g/s800/Obraz%2520182.jpg

The Turn bank indicator if that is what they called it has a smashed glass, and judging by the sand behind it may of had for some time, as the Flight Director and the other instruments such as the Turn Bank indicator and turn slip indicators are i would have thought all Gyros run off the VAC System, has he had a fault with the system or suspects an blocked intake filter etc and is there an emergency procedure to smash the instrument glass and allow unfiltered air in.? the missing clock could have been removed by him for navigation, to try and walk out.....

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21 years 6 months

Posts: 9,780

Sutts -I think its worth pointing out that aircraft have on two occasions at Duxford had items stolen from them at a national museum. It's hardly fair to insinuate that we are in some way better than 'Johnny Foreigner' when not that long ago we had Spitfires on fire dumps and gunnery ranges.