By: TEEJ
- 24th May 2016 at 21:20Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Those A-10 might have crossed Syrian border, but are we sure they aren't used in North Iraq against ISIS there?
A-10s from Incirlik routinely cross the Turkish border into Syria to provide close air support.
Recent ops in Syria
The US has informed Russia where US Special Forces are inside Syria and they have agreed to stay clear of those areas. A-10s will routinely provide top cover to those US forces.
The Pentagon told the Russian military where U.S. Special Forces are located in Syria with the hopes that Russian aircraft will steer clear of that area and not risk bombing American service members, top military officials said Thursday.
The disclosure reveals an expanded level of military–to-military communication and cooperation between the two countries beyond the basic “memorandum of understanding,” or MOU, that was signed in October and focused on safety protocols for air crews operating in Syrian air space.
“We provided a geographical area that we asked them to stay out of because of the risk to U.S. forces,” Pentagon spokesman Peter Cook told reporters Thursday.
“This was a step we took to try to maintain their safety in a dangerous situation and this was a request that we made to the Russians outside the scope of the" memorandum of understanding, Cook said.
“Up to this point, [the Russians] have honored this request,” Cook said.
By: maurobaggio
- 25th May 2016 at 03:41Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Indeed. Just as no SAM system can boast a 100% success rate, the same must apply to anti-SAM systems.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge about the SA 18 in that post.
I have agree with your statement above in the box, however I would like to make just simple comment about this issue:
In the case of SAM( MANPADS) those 'fireworks' can be several times less efficient( Success Rate) than Anti-SAM systems, yet those SAM could have become several times more effective than the anti-SAM systems in the war.
Two examples: first the US had been estimated in the 80s that for every 'MiG' or 'Mi-24' shoot down in Afghanistan were necessary 10 Stinger missiles.
The second example was that the former Soviet Union demonstrated for West such Su 25 had been hit on several occasions by 5 Stinger missiles in this war, and still was operational.
If only the second example were true, still the Soviet Union did not mention the cost to repair the Su 25 as well as the time in which it were grounded in this reason.In fact it would be an evidence of the impact of MANPADS in this war.
Otherwise the main fact should be that the Soviet Union lost the war in Afghanistan, and MANPADS Stinger had been highly important about this, once the impact about morale of Soviet troops in Afghanistan, as well as the political impact of the portable system( MANPADS) were capable to shoot down their aircraft's, actually it was more overwhelming than the own cost in equipment and crew for the former Soviet Union.
In my humble opinion the crew of the AH 1W ,that were kill in action by MANPADS, indeed they should receive such medal for bravery, after all they were flying alone at low altitude, as well as in mission during the day over the enemy territory with presence of the MANPADS like the SA 18 or SA 24.
So if I was the AH 1W pilot who had received such order for this mission in those conditions from my commanding officer, in fact today I would be alive, however prisoner awaiting for the court martial.
However I am not a pilot or an analyst like you, in fact I'm just the packer goods in the supermarket .
If this has not been obvious in this text, just ask for Loke and his will confirm my identity as well as the supermarket when I have been working for these days.
By: Sanem
- 18th July 2016 at 08:50Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
earlier this year, reports surfaced of Saudi Arabia, Turkey and others wanting to launch a ground invasion of Syria
undoubtedly urged on by the West, as Russia went on the offensive and helped Assad and his allies succesfully push back the rebels and ISIS
but other than Saudi F-15's deploying to Turkey and some semi-accidental Turkish attacks on the border, nothing came of this
there were several indications that elements within the Saudi and Turkish military and political caste weren't too fond of the idea
on an unrelated topic, on May 22 I wrote in the "How-can-Argentina-stop-the-F-35B" thread a fictional news story about how an ISIS attack was used as a pretext by Argentina to not only invade the Falklands, but also to take out a number of top generals that were opposing the government
it was ment as a satire on how false flags are used to start wars and take out political opposition http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?138835-How-can-Argentina-stop-the-F-35B&p=2314018#post2314018
clearly my limited imagination wouldn't get me into the CIA, as in Turkey up to 6,000 of the judicial and military elite are being arrested following the failed coup
including the commander of the Incirlik air base
all this certainly comes a disturbing time, as on May 24 a new Turkish PM was introduced, a yes-man who's likely more open to the idea of a Turkish invasion of Syria
and just yesterday Assad's forces officially captured part of the Castello road, effectively cutting off the last supply line into Aleppo
one certainly wonders what Erdogan might intend to do with all this new found power, and no one left to challenge him...
By: Marcellogo
- 18th July 2016 at 12:45Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Haavarla, you are wrong in your assesment. F-15Cs were only there for 3 weeks or so. USAF operated 6 F-16's for months. After shooting down event, those F-16's were slowly replaced with a dozen A-10Cs. Whether not to operate same type of aircraft as TuAF to avoid getting shot, or to provide CAS better for longer times, I don't know. In any case, those routinely operate at northern Syria there are several dozen videos "syria.liveuamap.com" showing just that. Add to that, since 10.12.2015, there are a 4-6 Tornado IDSs of German Air Force, they routinely fly recon for German Air Force since 8 Jan 2016. Since February, there are 4 Saudi F-15s in Incirlik, but I am unaware if they have ever flown a mission.
So It is confirmed that when the things get tought the A-10 comes in and the teeny weeny fighterinnys carrying small guided bombetinnys come home?:eek::eek::eek:
By: haavarla
- 18th July 2016 at 13:35Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Its safe to claim A-10 doing air support for Kurds and US "instructors".
By now US has stepped back on anti Assad/Russia retorics and Russia/US are co-OP quite nicely.
There are numerous news article to support this.
As it stands, Turkey is very much denied access to Syrian OP by the Russian forces in the Region.
It remain to see if Turkish affairs can accomondate and aid Russian interest(fighting Islamic terrorists) in the Region..
I have my doubts.
By: Marcellogo
- 18th July 2016 at 15:37Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Its safe to claim A-10 doing air support for Kurds and US "instructors".
By now US has stepped back on anti Assad/Russia retorics and Russia/US are co-OP quite nicely.
There are numerous news article to support this.
As it stands, Turkey is very much denied access to Syrian OP by the Russian forces in the Region.
It remain to see if Turkish affairs can accomondate and aid Russian interest(fighting Islamic terrorists) in the Region..
I have my doubts.
Thank for reply. Stay however certain that for "thing get tough" I absolutely meant CAS mission itself.
I used irony to summarize in just one line all the long list of objections I personally have about a certain american/western approach to air warfare and that I have spreaded in different trends/topics along those years, in Mphotos earlier and now in this more focused but excellent forum.
By: TEEJ
- 18th July 2016 at 19:11Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
So It is confirmed that when the things get tought the A-10 comes in and the teeny weeny fighterinnys carrying small guided bombetinnys come home?:eek::eek::eek:
Don't forget the B-52s which are no doubt deploying SDBs over Syria. :) ISIS were releasing images of the B-52s over Syria last month.
The US-backed Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) stormed into the Isis stronghold of Manbij yesterday with the support of US B-52 bombers and special forces after a three-week siege.
Yes, you can easily see there how even B-52 (and before them B-1B over Kobane) are better for CAS than TeWeFi-s dropping SmaGuBo-s. No smiley there: it is a serious statement.
The fact that someone use tactical fighters in long range missions against industrial installations and instead intercontinental bombers for CAS is just one of the many absurdities (altough in the sheer tactical point of view it make sense) I was talking about.
By: JSR
- 19th July 2016 at 23:19Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It seems Turkey is now unofficially islamic republic if the purges stand. Russia can now open new relationship with them based on squeezing money and intelligence out of West and Middleast. http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKCN0ZY1PO
By: Sanem
- 24th August 2016 at 10:16Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
...how an ISIS attack was used as a pretext by Argentina to not only invade the Falklands, but also to take out a number of top generals that were opposing the government
it was ment as a satire on how false flags are used to start wars and take out political opposition
- terrorist group at your border begging you to invade? check
- coup attempt, forcing you to purge your military? check
- gruesome terrorist attack by same group provoking immediate military deployment? check
Turkey has now officially launched operations into Syrian territory, as I've predicted months ago
I also predicted Saudi Arabia would attack next. but if they do, they will attack Assad directly
By: Broccoli
- 24th August 2016 at 12:51Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Its safe to claim A-10 doing air support for Kurds and US "instructors".
By now US has stepped back on anti Assad/Russia retorics and Russia/US are co-OP quite nicely.
There are numerous news article to support this.
As it stands, Turkey is very much denied access to Syrian OP by the Russian forces in the Region.
It remain to see if Turkish affairs can accomondate and aid Russian interest(fighting Islamic terrorists) in the Region..
I have my doubts.
Apparently Turks didn't get the memo.
New
Posts: 288
By: sepheronx
- 24th August 2016 at 15:47Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If anyone follows this guy: https://mobile.twitter.com/sayed_ridha you will notice he posts pics of FSA/Al-Sham advances in Jarablus, notice no dead bodies or damage showing an actual fight? This is leading people to believe this is purely a way for Turkey and US to take territory and create a buffer zone for their terrorist friends to build up in. Eventually it will expand and Russia and Syrian gov will have a huge problem on their hands. I fodder a Libya 2.0 at the end and Russia kicked out of Syria. Will also end up ruining Russia's relations with any remaining countries who aren't part of the whole western hatred of Russia.
I have to say, Russia should have stepped up and told the others to screw off. Now looks like Turkey/US is going to win this and not so much for Assad.
New
Posts: 4,472
By: Nicolas10
- 24th August 2016 at 17:38Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If anyone follows this guy: https://mobile.twitter.com/sayed_ridha you will notice he posts pics of FSA/Al-Sham advances in Jarablus, notice no dead bodies or damage showing an actual fight? This is leading people to believe this is purely a way for Turkey and US to take territory and create a buffer zone for their terrorist friends to build up in. Eventually it will expand and Russia and Syrian gov will have a huge problem on their hands. I fodder a Libya 2.0 at the end and Russia kicked out of Syria. Will also end up ruining Russia's relations with any remaining countries who aren't part of the whole western hatred of Russia.
I have to say, Russia should have stepped up and told the others to screw off. Now looks like Turkey/US is going to win this and not so much for Assad.
By: JSR
- 24th August 2016 at 17:46Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If anyone follows this guy: https://mobile.twitter.com/sayed_ridha you will notice he posts pics of FSA/Al-Sham advances in Jarablus, notice no dead bodies or damage showing an actual fight? This is leading people to believe this is purely a way for Turkey and US to take territory and create a buffer zone for their terrorist friends to build up in. Eventually it will expand and Russia and Syrian gov will have a huge problem on their hands. I fodder a Libya 2.0 at the end and Russia kicked out of Syria. Will also end up ruining Russia's relations with any remaining countries who aren't part of the whole western hatred of Russia.
I have to say, Russia should have stepped up and told the others to screw off. Now looks like Turkey/US is going to win this and not so much for Assad.
it was Iranian that wanted Turkey to manage Syria. Russia will keep the coast with those Soviet trained Alwaite.
By: Sanem
- 24th August 2016 at 22:37Permalink- Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
This is leading people to believe this is purely a way for Turkey and US to take territory and create a buffer zone for their terrorist friends to build up in.
there are plenty of indications that ISIS has close ties with Turkey, a country with a history of false flag operations
ISIS is the black sheep that allowed the coalition to intervene in the Syria conflict
the only downside from creating such a puppy-murdering and freedom hating boogey man is that Russia also used it as an excuse to intervene, and now Turkey
note that Turkey says it's intervention is 100% legal under international law, because it's moving against Daesh
Posts: 2,318
By: TEEJ - 24th May 2016 at 21:20 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
A-10s from Incirlik routinely cross the Turkish border into Syria to provide close air support.
Recent ops in Syria
The US has informed Russia where US Special Forces are inside Syria and they have agreed to stay clear of those areas. A-10s will routinely provide top cover to those US forces.
http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/2016/02/18/us-quietly-tells-russia-where-us-special-forces-located-syria/80561370/
Posts: 516
By: maurobaggio - 25th May 2016 at 03:41 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thank you for sharing your knowledge about the SA 18 in that post.
I have agree with your statement above in the box, however I would like to make just simple comment about this issue:
In the case of SAM( MANPADS) those 'fireworks' can be several times less efficient( Success Rate) than Anti-SAM systems, yet those SAM could have become several times more effective than the anti-SAM systems in the war.
Two examples: first the US had been estimated in the 80s that for every 'MiG' or 'Mi-24' shoot down in Afghanistan were necessary 10 Stinger missiles.
The second example was that the former Soviet Union demonstrated for West such Su 25 had been hit on several occasions by 5 Stinger missiles in this war, and still was operational.
If only the second example were true, still the Soviet Union did not mention the cost to repair the Su 25 as well as the time in which it were grounded in this reason.In fact it would be an evidence of the impact of MANPADS in this war.
Otherwise the main fact should be that the Soviet Union lost the war in Afghanistan, and MANPADS Stinger had been highly important about this, once the impact about morale of Soviet troops in Afghanistan, as well as the political impact of the portable system( MANPADS) were capable to shoot down their aircraft's, actually it was more overwhelming than the own cost in equipment and crew for the former Soviet Union.
In my humble opinion the crew of the AH 1W ,that were kill in action by MANPADS, indeed they should receive such medal for bravery, after all they were flying alone at low altitude, as well as in mission during the day over the enemy territory with presence of the MANPADS like the SA 18 or SA 24.
So if I was the AH 1W pilot who had received such order for this mission in those conditions from my commanding officer, in fact today I would be alive, however prisoner awaiting for the court martial.
However I am not a pilot or an analyst like you, in fact I'm just the packer goods in the supermarket .
If this has not been obvious in this text, just ask for Loke and his will confirm my identity as well as the supermarket when I have been working for these days.
Posts: 593
By: Sanem - 31st May 2016 at 23:53 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
seems to be reports that Turkey has moved troops into Syria, near Azaz, north of Aleppo
Posts: 593
By: Sanem - 18th July 2016 at 08:50 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
earlier this year, reports surfaced of Saudi Arabia, Turkey and others wanting to launch a ground invasion of Syria
undoubtedly urged on by the West, as Russia went on the offensive and helped Assad and his allies succesfully push back the rebels and ISIS
but other than Saudi F-15's deploying to Turkey and some semi-accidental Turkish attacks on the border, nothing came of this
there were several indications that elements within the Saudi and Turkish military and political caste weren't too fond of the idea
on an unrelated topic, on May 22 I wrote in the "How-can-Argentina-stop-the-F-35B" thread a fictional news story about how an ISIS attack was used as a pretext by Argentina to not only invade the Falklands, but also to take out a number of top generals that were opposing the government
it was ment as a satire on how false flags are used to start wars and take out political opposition
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?138835-How-can-Argentina-stop-the-F-35B&p=2314018#post2314018
clearly my limited imagination wouldn't get me into the CIA, as in Turkey up to 6,000 of the judicial and military elite are being arrested following the failed coup
including the commander of the Incirlik air base
all this certainly comes a disturbing time, as on May 24 a new Turkish PM was introduced, a yes-man who's likely more open to the idea of a Turkish invasion of Syria
and just yesterday Assad's forces officially captured part of the Castello road, effectively cutting off the last supply line into Aleppo
one certainly wonders what Erdogan might intend to do with all this new found power, and no one left to challenge him...
Posts: 1,765
By: Marcellogo - 18th July 2016 at 12:45 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
So It is confirmed that when the things get tought the A-10 comes in and the teeny weeny fighterinnys carrying small guided bombetinnys come home?:eek::eek::eek:
Posts: 6,441
By: haavarla - 18th July 2016 at 13:35 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Its safe to claim A-10 doing air support for Kurds and US "instructors".
By now US has stepped back on anti Assad/Russia retorics and Russia/US are co-OP quite nicely.
There are numerous news article to support this.
As it stands, Turkey is very much denied access to Syrian OP by the Russian forces in the Region.
It remain to see if Turkish affairs can accomondate and aid Russian interest(fighting Islamic terrorists) in the Region..
I have my doubts.
Posts: 1,765
By: Marcellogo - 18th July 2016 at 15:37 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thank for reply. Stay however certain that for "thing get tough" I absolutely meant CAS mission itself.
I used irony to summarize in just one line all the long list of objections I personally have about a certain american/western approach to air warfare and that I have spreaded in different trends/topics along those years, in Mphotos earlier and now in this more focused but excellent forum.
Posts: 2,318
By: TEEJ - 18th July 2016 at 19:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Don't forget the B-52s which are no doubt deploying SDBs over Syria. :) ISIS were releasing images of the B-52s over Syria last month.
http://isis.liveuamap.com/en/2016/30-may-syria-isis-films-what-appears-to-be-a-b52-on-a-combat
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/squabbles-between-us-allies-threaten-advance-on-raqqa-3b8z78hb5
Posts: 1,765
By: Marcellogo - 18th July 2016 at 22:30 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Yes, you can easily see there how even B-52 (and before them B-1B over Kobane) are better for CAS than TeWeFi-s dropping SmaGuBo-s. No smiley there: it is a serious statement.
The fact that someone use tactical fighters in long range missions against industrial installations and instead intercontinental bombers for CAS is just one of the many absurdities (altough in the sheer tactical point of view it make sense) I was talking about.
Posts: 4,731
By: JSR - 19th July 2016 at 23:19 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It seems Turkey is now unofficially islamic republic if the purges stand. Russia can now open new relationship with them based on squeezing money and intelligence out of West and Middleast.
http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKCN0ZY1PO
Posts: 5,905
By: TomcatViP - 20th July 2016 at 01:35 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
We have respected posters there. Let's hope that they are all safe.
Posts: 6,441
By: haavarla - 21st July 2016 at 03:06 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
What the hell is this all about..??
http://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2016/07/19/incirlik-air-base-still-without-power/87316140/
If US had nothing to do with this, why aren't power restored! And supply(water), also brought in?
Posts: 5,905
By: TomcatViP - 21st July 2016 at 04:38 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Turkey filed a court order for the alleged plotter extradition today. -> flexing muscle and pressuring the US.
Posts: 593
By: Sanem - 24th August 2016 at 10:16 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
- terrorist group at your border begging you to invade? check
- coup attempt, forcing you to purge your military? check
- gruesome terrorist attack by same group provoking immediate military deployment? check
Turkey has now officially launched operations into Syrian territory, as I've predicted months ago
I also predicted Saudi Arabia would attack next. but if they do, they will attack Assad directly
Posts: 272
By: Broccoli - 24th August 2016 at 12:51 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Apparently Turks didn't get the memo.
Posts: 288
By: sepheronx - 24th August 2016 at 15:47 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If anyone follows this guy: https://mobile.twitter.com/sayed_ridha you will notice he posts pics of FSA/Al-Sham advances in Jarablus, notice no dead bodies or damage showing an actual fight? This is leading people to believe this is purely a way for Turkey and US to take territory and create a buffer zone for their terrorist friends to build up in. Eventually it will expand and Russia and Syrian gov will have a huge problem on their hands. I fodder a Libya 2.0 at the end and Russia kicked out of Syria. Will also end up ruining Russia's relations with any remaining countries who aren't part of the whole western hatred of Russia.
I have to say, Russia should have stepped up and told the others to screw off. Now looks like Turkey/US is going to win this and not so much for Assad.
Posts: 4,472
By: Nicolas10 - 24th August 2016 at 17:38 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Sad but credible indeed.
Nic
Posts: 4,731
By: JSR - 24th August 2016 at 17:46 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
it was Iranian that wanted Turkey to manage Syria. Russia will keep the coast with those Soviet trained Alwaite.
Posts: 9,579
By: TR1 - 24th August 2016 at 18:30 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
So Turkey finally decided they could not tolerate further SDF successes....not surprised.
Posts: 593
By: Sanem - 24th August 2016 at 22:37 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
there are plenty of indications that ISIS has close ties with Turkey, a country with a history of false flag operations
ISIS is the black sheep that allowed the coalition to intervene in the Syria conflict
the only downside from creating such a puppy-murdering and freedom hating boogey man is that Russia also used it as an excuse to intervene, and now Turkey
note that Turkey says it's intervention is 100% legal under international law, because it's moving against Daesh