Chinese air power thread 18

Profile picture for user Deino

Member for

19 years 11 months

Posts: 4,074

great thanks. good work on finding all the accurate measurements on the j-10 and j-20.
always proving the bots wrong!

I realy do not know why again you insist in this discussion? The J-10's dimensions were officially confirmed since years and noone with really interest and knowlegde questions them. Noone reliable said it has the size of a J-10. So why always provoking and trolling around with false accusations?
I'm still waiting for any of your proofs concerning the claims you accused me. I never said the J-20 is only 18 m long and so many other things too ... you are flop-flopping answers, bashing personally instead of argueing ...

That's indeed all you can ... simply a troll par excellance.

Profile picture for user KGB

Member for

3 years 8 months

Posts: 1,168

these are not properly scaled and comes from a brazilian website.
j-20 is closer to 20m, pakfa closer to 22

Sigh...

The lengths coincide with the lengths on Wikipedia for each aircraft.

The J 20 is way bigger than Pak Fa or Raptor and is about the same length as the Mig 1.44. And I wonder why that is...

Member for

10 years 7 months

Posts: 80

why should I buy me?

More french kisses to my best troll :D

On a side note, slightly off topic but can anyone share me a link with F-22 carrying 4 fuel tanks? I believe it did carry it during tests.

Member for

15 years

Posts: 1,620

I realy do not know why again you insist in this discussion? The J-10's dimensions were officially confirmed since years and noone with really interest and knowlegde questions them. Noone reliable said it has the size of a J-10. So why always provoking and trolling around with false accusations?
I'm still waiting for any of your proofs concerning the claims you accused me. I never said the J-20 is only 18 m long and so many other things too ... you are flop-flopping answers, bashing personally instead of argueing ...

That's indeed all you can ... simply a troll par excellance.

Deino....don't take it to heart, especially his personal criticism of you.
Over the years I've enjoyed your input, as I'm sure many others have, and you have published some wonderful books on Chinese aviation.

I don't think Y-20 Bacon is being serious....in fact, even when he was F-18 Hamburger almost 20 years ago on this forum, he was much the same.
I think he provokes to get a discussion going.;)

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

Deino....don't take it to heart, especially his personal criticism of you.
Over the years I've enjoyed your input, as I'm sure many others have, and you have published some wonderful books on Chinese aviation.

I don't think Y-20 Bacon is being serious....in fact, even when he was F-18 Hamburger almost 20 years ago on this forum, he was much the same.
I think he provokes to get a discussion going.;)

he's easily excitable these days and addicted to me! yum

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

More french kisses to my best troll :D

On a side note, slightly off topic but can anyone share me a link with F-22 carrying 4 fuel tanks? I believe it did carry it during tests.

love that tongue of yours ;)

and here you go

https://s16.postimg.org/nefs5gehx/download_1.jpg

Profile picture for user obligatory

Member for

11 years 1 month

Posts: 6,983

ahem...you might want to fix that link bacon

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

ahem...you might want to fix that link bacon

ok sexy I will!

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040


The J 20 is way bigger than Pak Fa or Raptor and is about the same length as the Mig 1.44. And I wonder why that is...

and why is that

Profile picture for user obligatory

Member for

11 years 1 month

Posts: 6,983

and why is that

oh no ! dont bait yet again

Member for

5 years

Posts: 269

Deino....don't take it to heart, especially his personal criticism of you.
Over the years I've enjoyed your input, as I'm sure many others have, and you have published some wonderful books on Chinese aviation.

I don't think Y-20 Bacon is being serious....in fact, even when he was F-18 Hamburger almost 20 years ago on this forum, he was much the same.
I think he provokes to get a discussion going.;)

no, Deino speaks for all of us. And we are sick and tired of Russian nationalists invading our section with their pettiness and jealousy.
They know our J-10 and J-20 are innovative designs. they know the J-20 put significantly more effort in all around stealth not just the front. they know the j-20 will reach service first, even though its first flight was later.
that is why they are so desperate to discredit it with things like being a mig, even though it looks NOTHING like it. or its size. even though all Chinese aviation fans know J-10 is 15m and J-20 is 20m. look it up.

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

from Tango's post (he's a completely neutral, non biased contributor)


By 1990, the technical sophistication of the PLA had deteriorated to the degree that Iraqi forces enjoyed a considerable advantage over their Chinese counterparts.

The Iraqi Air Force included MiG-23s, MiG-25s and MiG-29s, while the PLAAF relied on Chinese-produced copycats of the MiG-21, as well as older aircraft such as the MiG-19. Similarly, the Iraqi air defense system, which had failed to incur major damage on waves of attacking American aircraft, was at least as sophisticated as the systems China was capable of employing.

The Chinese had also discovered, through access to Iraqi tanks captured by the Iranians in the Persian Gulf War, that the Iraqi T-72s that presented no challenge whatsoever to the U.S. Army — and were considerably superior to extant Chinese tanks.

the problem therein lies that their latest type 99s are derived heavily from the T-72s

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

no, Deino speaks for all of us. And we are sick and tired of Russian nationalists invading our section with their pettiness and jealousy.
They know our J-10 and J-20 are innovative designs. they know the J-20 put significantly more effort in all around stealth not just the front. they know the j-20 will reach service first, even though its first flight was later.
that is why they are so desperate to discredit it with things like being a mig, even though it looks NOTHING like it. or its size. even though all Chinese aviation fans know J-10 is 15m and J-20 is 20m. look it up.

plus roughtly 1.5 meters for both ;)

Profile picture for user Y-20 Bacon

Member for

6 years 7 months

Posts: 2,040

while our chinabot friends are feverishly debating over the size of airplanes or non-existant stealth paint
something bad happened. a JH-7 crashed a few hours ago

http://defence-blog.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/CvXn96bWIAAInf1.jpg

no word on the pilots. but it would probably be a good time to consider withdrawing these old jets.

Profile picture for user KGB

Member for

3 years 8 months

Posts: 1,168

oh no ! dont bait yet again

There was more than 1 to choose from.

http://st.gnnxxx.net/staticFile/Subject/2016/08/11/556742/2g.jpg

Profile picture for user KGB

Member for

3 years 8 months

Posts: 1,168

no, Deino speaks for all of us. And we are sick and tired of Russian nationalists invading our section with their pettiness and jealousy.
They know our J-10 and J-20 are innovative designs. they know the J-20 put significantly more effort in all around stealth not just the front. they know the j-20 will reach service first, even though its first flight was later.
that is why they are so desperate to discredit it with things like being a mig, even though it looks NOTHING like it. or its size. even though all Chinese aviation fans know J-10 is 15m and J-20 is 20m. look it up.

This is just a dishonest statement. You are entitled to claim that the J 20 is a clean slate Chinese design. But you cannot claim that the Pak Fa is bigger than the J 20 or that the J 20 is not similar in length to the Mig 1.44

I would advise you to take a more cordial stance on Russia with regard to the J 20 and save the venom for your American or western critics. Because China and Russia are allies. I never wanted to say anything bad about the J 20 until ppl like you start claiming that China has passed Russia in expertise. When clearly they have not because they still use Russian engines.

Member for

8 years 7 months

Posts: 655

Sigh...

The lengths coincide with the lengths on Wikipedia for each aircraft.

The J 20 is way bigger than Pak Fa or Raptor and is about the same length as the Mig 1.44. And I wonder why that is...


Because information on wikipedia is infallible amiright?

Anyways, I suspect we won't have to wait for much longer for an official figure. If the upcoming Zhuhai Aerospace Convention will be featuring the J-20 they will probably provide some basic specs.

That said, in before the "China fakes its statistics!" crowd.

Profile picture for user KGB

Member for

3 years 8 months

Posts: 1,168

Because information on wikipedia is infallible amiright?

Anyways, I suspect we won't have to wait for much longer for an official figure. If the upcoming Zhuhai Aerospace Convention will be featuring the J-20 they will probably provide some basic specs.

That said, in before the "China fakes its statistics!" crowd.

It is close enough data that we can assume a few things. Anyone with eyes can see that its a rather big aircraft

What is your approximate guess though ? Do you believe that its shorter than the Pak Fa >?>

Member for

8 years 7 months

Posts: 655

This is just a dishonest statement. You are entitled to claim that the J 20 is a clean slate Chinese design. But you cannot claim that the Pak Fa is bigger than the J 20 or that the J 20 is not similar in length to the Mig 1.44

I would advise you to take a more cordial stance on Russia with regard to the J 20 and save the venom for your American or western critics. Because China and Russia are allies. I never wanted to say anything bad about the J 20 until ppl like you start claiming that China has passed Russia in expertise. When clearly they have not because they still use Russian engines.


It is dishonest to claim the J-20 is any length without also acknowledging we actually don't know. Regardless of the reasons we think it's 19 meters or 23 meters, these are all estimations. No one should have any confidence to assert a categorical claim here.

Not that I have a personal dog in this fight (I'm American, actually), but your second paragraph reeks of a "We're friends only if you think I'm superior mentality". If I were a Russian nationalist I'd worry about blind spots....

Member for

19 years 11 months

Posts: 805

J-20 is actually designed with extrememly advanced 6th gen quantum harmonic oscillation camouflage. Thus in accordance with Heisenberg uncertainty principle, when under observation it can be both 20 and 23 meters long at the same time.